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09 Civic intermittent No Crank

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This topic contains 12 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by college man college man 10 months, 2 weeks ago.

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    Topic
  • #895149
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    2009 Honda Civic LX 4dr Auto, 185K 1.8L
    This has happened multiple times.
    7am: Daughter leaves for school. 0.5 miles away.
    2pm: Daughter Leaves school for home: She said car does not Crank.
    5pm: I go there to take a look: No Crank, , no clicking, no buzzing. all dash lights work, headlights are bright.
    8pm: Come back: Cranks and runs fine, no loss of power, everything works.

    I was able to reproduce the issue by taking the car for a short drive.
    Cranks and starts fine (5+ times) immediately and within 1-2 hours after short drive.
    After about 2-3 hours of letting it sit, it wont Crank.
    After about 5-6 hours, it cranks start, and runs fine.

    Trying to eliminate the causes, I have tried the following so far when it DOES NOT Crank: All these resulted in No Crank

    • Tested Battery at two different auto shops , both tested GOOD and CCA above rated.
    • Tried to crank in Neutral
    • Tried to crank in Park while jiggling the gear shifter.
    • Tapped on starter, then tried to crank.
    • Tapped on Starter while having someone try to crank.
    • Changed Starter relay under the driver side dashboard plastics.
    • Placed test light on yellow wire of the ignition switch connector and tried to crank (Test light lights up. )

    Does this eliminate the Battery, Starter, P/N Safety Switch, Starter Relay and the Ignition Switch?

    I was thinking maybe the Alternator or Parasitic Battery drain, but why would it crank 6 hours later or the next morning?

    I’m running out of ideas, any suggestions/ideas would be appreciated. TIA

Viewing 12 replies - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)
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  • #895163
    college man
    college man
    Moderator

    This guy shows some decent troubleshooting. The only thing I would do different is to test the starter in place with a test light or
    meter instead of pulling it. Have someone crank the car while you test for power. If power is there and no starter, time to change the
    starter. Check all the wiring for corrosion. if no power is seen work your way back.

    https://www.ericthecarguy.com/faq/solving-automotive-no-start-problems/no-crank-no-start

    #895166
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    Thanks for the reply and link to the video. That was the video I watched a few times to get to the point that I am at, very nice explanation of the starting system.

    Checking signal at the starter was going to be my next step, but as you probably already know, its a PITA to get to without a lift.

    #895172
    college man
    college man
    Moderator

    some car ramps or jack stands should get you up off the ground safely. keep us posted on your progress.

    #895201
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    I was planning on testing for voltage at the starter, but could not get the car to NOT CRANK after replacing the key fob cover. The original one was cracked a little and I thought that maybe the lock button was getting stuck. Although I did notice the green key light would go off when i put the key in prior to changing the fob cover. I was hoping that was the problem. But no luck, it happened again today, after about 8-10 trips. Of course this happens right when it starts getting cold here in the NorthEast.
    Still trying to figure it out.

    #895241
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    I put the car up and tested for voltage at the starter and its good at that point.
    I was able to reproduce the NO Crank again, this time by just letting the car run for about 10 minutes and then turning it off and the then try to start it .

    I started researching again for more possibilities and ran across another video, this time about Warm/Hot engine, No Crank. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPAIFL8VH9w
    They mention the ECT, Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor, as a culprit. They get that from a CEL and P0115 code, but I am not getting a CEL on my car.
    Also, the temp gauge isn’t showing that the car is overheating.

    Wondering if anyone has any input on that possibility?

    #895243
    Billy
    Billy
    Participant

    When having the problem, do you have 12V at the solenoid? If so, check grounds and get starter tested. If not, check the relay, then the starter interlock switch, then the ignition switch.
    Checking the grounds should really be your starting point.

    #895247
    college man
    college man
    Moderator

    Really the ect has nothing to do with the starter circuit. As stated above, Power and ground needs to be checked when the problem exists.
    If power and ground are present and the starter does not crank then the starter is the culprit.

    #895255
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    Thank you I will test those things mentioned.
    Today I watched the video again and this is where I am at:

    I am able to reproduce it by running the car for about 10-15mins,
    The car starts fine within a few mins of turning it off.
    After about 15-20 mins, I does NOT CRANK.
    If I wait about 2-3 hours, then it Cranks and runs great.

    I followed the video I referenced in my first post, https://youtu.be/bPAIFL8VH9w, but stuck as to what to check next. Here is where I am:

    When it DOES NOT Crank:
    I am NOT getting a light when testing the connection behind master cylinder (@3:29).
    I am getting a light on the yellow wire (@4:37 ) at the fuse panel box under driver side panel.
    I removed the fuses in the Main Fuse and the Ignition Fuse in the panel box under the hood (@7:10) and tested them for continuity and they tested good, but still NO Crank.

    #895258
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    I spoke a guy who used to work at a shop that re-manufactured alt/starters, and he said 99% of the time its the Starter that is the issue and its caused by Heat Soak.
    Since I most likely wont be able to reproduce it at the Parts store, it will probably cool off by then, It wont be warrantied.
    I’m thinking of putting on a Heat Shield wrap and see if that helps.

    #895262
    college man
    college man
    Moderator

    keep us posted on your progress.

    #895272
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Imtiaz Vohra
    Participant

    Update…
    I removed the starter and made sure there were no corrosion or lose connections.
    I tested the voltage at the starter and got the same as at the battery.
    Since now I can remove and replace the starter with my eyes closed, I re-installed it.
    After re-installing it, I could NOT reproduce the “NO CRANK” problem all day on Sunday.
    I tested it by starting and let the car run for 20 mins, started the car every 15 mins a few times, then waited 30 mins a few times, then an hour and then 2 hours.
    It cranked all the time.
    Monday rolls around, and I was so confident that the problem was resolved, I told my daughter to take the car to school.
    She came home and then had to go back to school for something 20 mins later. IT DID NOT CRANK.

    Now I am frustrated and ready to throw in the towel.
    I decide to do a level set and start all over from scratch.
    This time, I noticed the connector behind the master cylinder was not giving any voltage when trying to start the car.
    I tested the battery, ignition, relay, and gear shifting again, all tested good.

    I recall about a year ago, my kids were driving the car and told me the gear led on the dash was jumping around, from P to R to N…, while they were driving.
    I had checked the Park/Neutral Safety switch and there was a little bit of water in it, so I cleaned it out and put some di-electric grease in it.

    So i decided to check that out again.
    It was very hard to pulling out the connector from the switch. (I don’t recall if the connector was clipped/clicked in or not)
    The connection wasn’t wet or damaged, so I figure I would just put it back in.
    I had a hard time clipping it back in, maybe there was too much grease in it?
    I took some grease out and was able to get the connector to click in.
    Monday night I took it for a few errands, and on Tuesday, I took it to work, then today, daughter took it to school, and so far no problems.
    I wanted to to wait a few days before throwing a party, but, 2 days feel like an eternity right now, especially because I had 2 vehicles down at the same time.
    Now both vehicles are back running and I don’t know what to do with all my free time.
    Love how all the car demons come out when the cold weather starts here in CT.

    Thanks to all that replied and offered advice.

    #895282
    college man
    college man
    Moderator

    Sounds good so far.

Viewing 12 replies - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)

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