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So, I’m new to the forums kinda. I’m a tech which is why I’m confiding in my peers lol.
I recently came across an unusual situation in my shop where a new kid opened his mouth on the topic of the day, fishbowlers… Aka the people who watch your every move while working on their car.
New kid said he didn’t mind people watching. I said your crazy( alittle less polite than that).
I was wondering what your thoughts were on watchers? I hate them, with a passion, but that’s just me.
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I know; it’s hard to believe an air hose could be strung out in a shop. I did have a hose unrolled that day BUT it was going to a car I had in the next stall; not theirs. This couple was nowhere near the hose.
In another case and for reasons unknown to me, the service manager wanted to allow this guy to be present while I did several repairs underneath the car.
If you knew this service manager you would know that logic and common sense were foreign words to him.Anywho, the guy was pleasant and asked a few misc questions while I proceeded with the repairs. However, after about 5 minutes he managed to insert himself into my way constantly. Every time I turned around I was bumping into him.
Finally, after about the 12th “Excuse me…” and “Could you please step back as this can be dangerous” I was totally POed.
He started poking his nose into the area I was working on so I walked over to the control valve for the lift. The safety was set but the lift was a few inches higher. This means it could be dropped a couple of inches without harm.
When I saw his head clear by about 6″ I slammed the valve to the DOWN position and the lift dropped like a rock for 2 inches.That guy jumped out there with eyes as big as saucers and no doubt heart pounding a 100 MPH. I then apologized for forgetting he was under the car but I had to lower the rack a few inches to make something more accessible. He then took my suggestion about going to the waiting room so as not to be crushed.
Our careers are of two different calibers my friend. You are in an air conditioned environment, we’re exposed to the elements. You’re dealing with light equipment, we’re literally defying gravity and delivering all of our trust into our lifts, if they fail, our lives are at stake. Any distraction can lead to a serious issue, customers have developed a sour taste for mechanics, and think we’re all crooks. So they want to watch to make sure you don’t pocket any of their change in their car or otherwise. I work downtown, so we have a lot of very wealthy customers, most of which are judges. One guys literally left 10,000 dollars in his glove compartment, knowing full well that I was going in there to reset the TPMS light. (It was a VW Jetta). As soon as I saw a brick of 100’s I jumped out of that car like it was on fire and refused to work on it any further until the money was removed. You have to be cautious in this field because if a customer claims you stole something, unless you have a good service manager that can sense bullshit; you’ll be held liable, which is never good because a lot of larger companies have a zero tolerance policy and will boot you to the curb. When I told the guy that the money was there, he looked me in the eye, said, “good job, you passed the test. I need my brakes done, my alignment done, and I have a RF control arm that needs replaced.” Turns out, he was wrenching while in law school and tested me to make sure I was ”trustworthy.” Never doubt the customer, but always be on guard.
Once again, I cross the yellow line and venture into the Technician’s Only forum.
I apologize for the transgression, but I wanted to chime in.Am I guilty of being a fishbowler? Yes. Yes, I am.
Even though I’m a SysAdmin by trade, I get people fishbowling me all the time… and they do it to me for the same reasons I do it to you.
What you do is pure MAGIC to the uninitiated. To see you take something that is effectively a black magic box to us (consider that the rank and file of your customers might not even know the axiom of ‘righty-tighty, lefty-loosey’) that won’t start… and then watch you pull it to little itty-bitty pieces? And -THEN- not only put all the pieces back together but make it run better than before?
Am I guilty of fishbowling? Yes. Yes, I am.
But I do it out of -respect- for you and the skills you possess. I watch in awe as you pull a transmission and make it work, when the best -I- could do is to wave a rubber chicken over a cracked bellhousing and hope that somehow it’ll Just Turn On.
On behalf of fisbowlers, sorry for putting you on the spot. But it’s like watching a magician ply their trade; totally enchanting, very interesting, and if anything, develops even more respect for the mechanics as a person and a profession.
My .02.
-Hinoki
I appreciate that dude. I hear you…but when it’s 100*F + and you got three tickets lined up behind the one your doing, sometimes it can get a little frustrating,but you made alot of sense.
My biggest concern is….. God forbid someone walks into the shop and hears some “shop talk”. You know what I’m talking about……at least where I work, there’s a lot of guys who have had interesting lifestyles to say the least, rude, crude and unfiltered. Last thing we need is for someone to call corporate and get the whole line fired.
Understood. I NEVER go into the shop unless ask.. that’s just plain RUDE.
As for shop-talk, I can cuss anyone under the table but for the saltiest of sailors.
That being said, I do understand.. and I’ll stay on the far side of the yellow line at the shops. Y’all need your privacy away from the likes of me, your customers.
Cheers.. and thanks again for all you do.
-Hinoki
[quote=”Hinoki” post=173867]Understood. I NEVER go into the shop unless ask.. that’s just plain RUDE.
As for shop-talk, I can cuss anyone under the table but for the saltiest of sailors.
That being said, I do understand.. and I’ll stay on the far side of the yellow line at the shops. Y’all need your privacy away from the likes of me, your customers.
Cheers.. and thanks again for all you do.
-Hinoki[/quote]
No problem. If you are allowed beyond the yellow line…… by all means do it! Lol… Just explaining how I felt. It good to see that you actually care and want to know what we do, unlike 90%of the people who could care less and have no desire to change their oil in the next 10,000 miles. It’s good to see that someone’s caring and interested… from the inside looking out…
Damn I might have a new outlook on fishbowlers after this thread
[quote=”Hinoki” post=173599]Once again, I cross the yellow line and venture into the Technician’s Only forum.
I apologize for the transgression, but I wanted to chime in.[/quote]
Another one here!Let me start off with this: not a certified car mechanic, but have home-rebuilt serveral cars, the first one before ever setting foot in an actual shop. The only time I even come into a shop is either for the mandatory annual safety inspection (where I *have* to watch in order for them to tell me what, if anything, is gonna need fixing), or something has gone wrong in a confusing way and I can’t get a diagnose (by) myself.
[quote=”gmule” post=171837]I hate them too. Just let me do my job please.[/quote]
Sure, but can I quietly stand and watch? No asking questions needed. Will exchange conversation if required/desired. No grumpy face, no judging.
In fact, having the car on a lift is a good opportunity to check our the underside, and that pretty much means I won’t even be looking at what you’re doing, just at the rest of the car.[quote=”gmule” post=171837]You know who I hate the worst? Those guys that come in with a problem I spend time diagnosing it and then they go home and do the work themselves. [/quote]
So? I pay a day of my wage for one hour of your diagnostic time, I pay for the service of diagnostics, I can do the wrenching myself. I’ve only done this on 2 or 3 occasions though in the past 6 years, the techs at the shop I went to didn’t seem to mind this at all, they were/are quite nice.Oh, I just thought of something, when I go to the tire shop, I just bring them the wheels and tires and put them on the car myself at home. Not so much a torque nazi, but I really can’t deal with the lug bolts being air-hammered to 3x the specified torque, even if that wouldn’t damage stuff, they would still be impossible to get back off at the side of a road in case of a flat. (I’ve been there, I needed a 4 ft extension and my full weight standing on it, for bolts specced to 90 nm.) So I guess I do judge on shops where they use the impact gun to ‘torque’ wheel bolts.
I keep two sets of rims and I go as far as having them remove my old winter tires off the rims during the summer. Then take them home and clean all the gunk off the tire bead that they skip.
[quote=”AlexanderB” post=176249][quote=”Hinoki” post=173599]Once again, I cross the yellow line and venture into the Technician’s Only forum.
I apologize for the transgression, but I wanted to chime in.[/quote]
Another one here!Let me start off with this: not a certified car mechanic, but have home-rebuilt serveral cars, the first one before ever setting foot in an actual shop. The only time I even come into a shop is either for the mandatory annual safety inspection (where I *have* to watch in order for them to tell me what, if anything, is gonna need fixing), or something has gone wrong in a confusing way and I can’t get a diagnose (by) myself.
[quote=”gmule” post=171837]I hate them too. Just let me do my job please.[/quote]
Sure, but can I quietly stand and watch? No asking questions needed. Will exchange conversation if required/desired. No grumpy face, no judging.
In fact, having the car on a lift is a good opportunity to check our the underside, and that pretty much means I won’t even be looking at what you’re doing, just at the rest of the c[quote=”gmule” post=171837]You know who I hate the worst? Those guys that come in with a problem I spend time diagnosing it and then they go home and do the work themselves. [/quote]
So? I pay a day of my wage for one hour of your diagnostic time, I pay for the service of diagnostics, I can do the wrenching myself. I’ve only done this on 2 or 3 occasions though in the past 6 years, the techs at the shop I went to didn’t seem to mind this at all, they were/are quite nice.Oh, I just thought of something, when I go to the tire shop, I just bring them the wheels and tires and put them on the car myself at home. Not so much a torque nazi, but I really can’t deal with the lug bolts being air-hammered to 3x the specified torque, even if that wouldn’t damage stuff, they would still be impossible to get back off at the side of a road in case of a flat. (I’ve been there, I needed a 4 ft extension and my full weight standing on it, for bolts specced to 90 nm.) So I guess I do judge on shops where they use the impact gun to ‘torque’ wheel bolts.[/quote]
If you are paying for diagnostic time that is great. If not you are stealing the technicians time. Us flat rate guys only make money while the wrenches are turning. It seems that most customers only value the repair and don’t think they should have to pay for diagnostics. At my shop the diagnostic time is credited to the cost of the repair.
I figure if you can make the repairs you can figure out what is wrong too.
The shop I went to has paid diagnostic time, its also not a dealership but a brand specialist (with focus on old-timers.)
[quote=”AlexanderB” post=176249][quote=”Hinoki” post=173599]Once again, I cross the yellow line and venture into the Technician’s Only forum.
I apologize for the transgression, but I wanted to chime in.[/quote]
Another one here!Let me start off with this: not a certified car mechanic, but have home-rebuilt serveral cars, the first one before ever setting foot in an actual shop. The only time I even come into a shop is either for the mandatory annual safety inspection (where I *have* to watch in order for them to tell me what, if anything, is gonna need fixing), or something has gone wrong in a confusing way and I can’t get a diagnose (by) myself.
[quote=”gmule” post=171837]I hate them too. Just let me do my job please.[/quote]
Sure, but can I quietly stand and watch? No asking questions needed. Will exchange conversation if required/desired. No grumpy face, no judging.
In fact, having the car on a lift is a good opportunity to check our the underside, and that pretty much means I won’t even be looking at what you’re doing, just at the rest of the car.[quote=”gmule” post=171837]You know who I hate the worst? Those guys that come in with a problem I spend time diagnosing it and then they go home and do the work themselves. [/quote]
So? I pay a day of my wage for one hour of your diagnostic time, I pay for the service of diagnostics, I can do the wrenching myself. I’ve only done this on 2 or 3 occasions though in the past 6 years, the techs at the shop I went to didn’t seem to mind this at all, they were/are quite nice.Oh, I just thought of something, when I go to the tire shop, I just bring them the wheels and tires and put them on the car myself at home. Not so much a torque nazi, but I really can’t deal with the lug bolts being air-hammered to 3x the specified torque, even if that wouldn’t damage stuff, they would still be impossible to get back off at the side of a road in case of a flat. (I’ve been there, I needed a 4 ft extension and my full weight standing on it, for bolts specced to 90 nm.) So I guess I do judge on shops where they use the impact gun to ‘torque’ wheel bolts.[/quote]
Sorry you feel that way about your lug nuts being too tight. I’d rather have you put a little more effort into taking your lug nuts off then getting a phone call saying I’m being sued because I had a wheel off……..
Oh, and I just thought of Something, I use my impact gun all day every day to ‘torque’ wheels on.
It’s called a torque stick.The shop where I usually get my tires mounted is quite a hack shop in my opinion, they most certainly don’t have torque sticks, they just run the bolts down full blast, me jumping my full body weight on a long extension was not an exaggeration, that would’ve left me stranded by the roadside if I had only the stock (short) wheel wrench to change a flat.
Why do I still go there? They’re cheap, they mount and balance 4 tires for the price of 1 at the big-name-chain shop. They do it in 1/3 the time too, but I guess they have to cut corners somewhere. The solution is easy, they just load the wheels into the trunk, I bolt them on at home, and they get to use the lift for some other customer at the same time. (Their small number of lifts is the limiting factor in customer throughput anyway), everybody wins.
I’m guessing the average customer CBF to notice the (very specific) noise a loose wheel makes, and just keeps rolling until the wheel falls off, nor would they bother to re-check the torque after some initial driving distance, even if they’re instructed to do so / told to come back for it. I guess a bit tighter is better in that case to prevent getting sued… but torqing the bolts so hard you can only really get them back off with the impact is too much, and that’s what they did to me.
Anyway, going back to the other side of the yellow line now, since I’m not an actual certified car tech. :side:
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